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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 12:50 am 
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Lán de Grás
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This thread is for any Tolkien-related or Middle-Earth-related topics, questions, or discussions that you feel don't warrant an entire thread of their own.

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For Bree stood at an old meeting of ways; another ancient road crossed the East Road just outside the dike at the western end of the village, and in former days Men and other folk of various sorts had travelled much on it. Strange as News from Bree was still a saying in the Eastfarthing, descending from those days, when news from North, South, and East could be heard in the inn, and when the Shire-hobbits used to go more often to hear it.


Fun fact: from my high-school days there was a guy who used to say "Well, that's News from Bree!" whenever he heard something interesting or unusual. And that's the only thing I remember about him. :D

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Last edited by Jude on Sat Dec 15, 2018 12:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 12:51 am 
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That's pretty cool!

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 12:58 am 
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So, this is what made me think of starting this thread in the first place: I was thinking of how Galadriel told Frodo that she could perceive Sauron's mind right then and there while she was speaking to him (Frodo). Which led me to wonder, why wasn't she immediately aware of Bilbo the moment he picked up the Ring?

Wandering further down this rabbit-hole, I then began to wonder why wasn't she aware of Gollum for the 500-odd years that he possessed the Ring?

My guess is that it's something that Tolkien just never thought of, but I'm willing to hear other hypotheses.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 1:13 am 
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I suggest that Galadriel is aware of Sauron because she 'bends her mind' to him. In other words she directs her awareness towards him (like a satellite dish?) because he's already in her knowledge base.
Her awareness, her radar, had no reason to turn towards Gollum or Bilbo because the Ring was thought to be lost, gone, gone, gone into the sea.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 1:32 am 
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I did think of that - but wouldn't she (at least occasionally) be bending her thought towards the Ring - just in case?

Edit: I see my thread-title got shortened. What's the maximum length a thread title can have?

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 1:43 am 
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Because if she could connect with a current Ring holder without knowing their identity, the Elves would have found the Ring eons ago and there would be no book. At least, not this one.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 1:56 am 
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I think the answer is in this sequence:

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‘I would ask one thing before we go,’ said Frodo, ‘a thing which I often meant to ask Gandalf in Rivendell. I am permitted to wear the One Ring: why cannot I see all the others and know the thoughts of those that wear them?’

‘You have not tried,’ she said. ‘Only thrice have you set the Ring upon your finger since you knew what you possessed. Do not try! It would destroy you. Did not Gandalf tell you that the rings give power according to the measure of each possessor? Before you could use that power you would need to become far stronger, and to train your will to the domination of others.



Since the Ring gives power according to the measure of each possessor, Bilbo would not have generated enough power to be on Galadriel's radar.

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Edit: I see my thread-title got shortened. What's the maximum length a thread title can have?


I checked in the ACP and I could not find a setting for that in the Posting Settings. Any suggestion as to where else I might look?

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 2:35 am 
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It also may have less to do with Galadriel's power to perceive others and more to do with Sauron attempting to actively wield power through his ring and specifically power over all the other rings. There is a level of 'power of the bearer' of course, which Gollum, Bilbo, and Frodo did not have, but they also never tried to use the Ring to control the others. It is not simply being in possession of the Ring which would trigger that kind of connection, I wouldn't think. It would be using the power of the One to control the rest.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2018 3:05 pm 
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I seem to have fixed the title. I wonder if I originally clicked outside the textbox while typing and didn't notice it...

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2019 5:45 am 
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I really like this take here. https://lotrfansaredorcs-the-white.tumb ... -where-the

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I love that thing in Lord of the Rings where the villains spend so much time obsessing over the character they believe is their Destined Archenemy that they overlook the character who actually defeats them

The Witch-King of Angmar, the Black Rider, seems to be Destined to fight the wizard Gandalf, the White Rider. He doesn’t consider Éowyn a threat right up until she stabs him in the face

Saruman is fixated on defeating Théoden, Aragorn and Gandalf in an Epic Light vs Dark Fantasy Battle at Helm’s Deep. So he completely overlooks the two hobbits and bunch of trees sitting right next door, who proceed to destroy Isengard

Sauron is fixated on defeating Aragorn, the Destined King of the Heroes and descendant of the man who defeated him last time. So he completely overlooks Frodo and Sam, who proceed to actually defeat him

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2019 5:57 am 
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I like that, too.

There is a note of that which I hope applies to the current political environment in the United States.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2019 8:55 pm 
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There is certainly some applicability to LOTR. Such as the part where Mordor was surrounded by an impregnable wall with a single, heavily-guarded gate.

Eta: BUILD THE WALL AND THE RING WON'T FALL
* ducks and runs *

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2019 11:57 pm 
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Frelga wrote:
There is certainly some applicability to LOTR. Such as the part where Mordor was surrounded by an impregnable wall with a single, heavily-guarded gate.

Eta: BUILD THE WALL AND THE RING WON'T FALL
* ducks and runs *


So, foreigners who walked on a caravan from far away sneak past all guards and securities, tunnel across the border, cause chaos among the native inhabitants, and ultimately use a stolen, smuggled weapon of mass destruction to destabilize rightful government leader and topple the entire regime, leaving a broken nation to be carved up between its enemies.

Yep.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2019 12:21 am 
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If only Sauron invested in a competent security personnel and surveillance measures instead of relying on the wall and neglecting his border forces, he might still be the ruler today.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2019 10:02 pm 
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When I first read The Hobbit, all those years ago, I assumed Smaug's name was a pun referring to smog and all the smoke and pollution that he breathed out. Then I made it through LOTR and the appendices and read the proper pronunciation of the "au" diphthong, and thought, "oops, guess not".

But, having read in one of the other threads here that The Hobbit was not originally meant as part of the Silmarillion universe but was retrofitted into it, I'm now wondering if my original thoughts were correct. What do you think?

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2019 11:18 pm 
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... wut? How are we supposed to pronounce Smaug?

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 03, 2019 11:19 pm 
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Tolkien says in Letter 25, "The dragon bears as name – a pseudonym – the past tense of the primitive Germanic verb Smugan, to squeeze through a hole: a low philological jest." According to Peter Gilliver, Edmund Weiner and Jeremy Marshall in The Ring of Words: Tolkien and the Oxford English Dictionary(pp. 190-1) the name is derived from the same Old English and Germanic roots as smial and Sméagol.


x-posted with elengil.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:12 am 
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Aha - so I was right about being wrong.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 12:31 am 
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If that was a low philological jest, I probably wouldn't want to know what a high one looks like.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2019 2:41 pm 
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"Smaug" is also a genus of lizards:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smaug_(genus)


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