There's really nothing in the text to support a battle of the magnitude you're describing. Realistically we're talking about a force of Lothlórien Elves, who live just across the river, and maybe some of the Dúnedain Rangers. Add to that the not inconsiderable strength of 3 Istari and a handful of High Elves, including Galadriel and Glorfindel.
Bear in mind that Gandalf thought the Necromancer might have been one of the Nazgûl, at worst. Its a big leap to go from that to Sauron, the Nine Nazgûl and a bunch of Trolls. What you're talking about would be like besieging Barad-dûr.
Let's write a Hobbit script of our own!
Ah...Gandalf discovered the Necromancer WAS Sauron in 2850...he spent the next 90 years trying to persuade Saruman to attack DG!Alatar wrote:Bear in mind that Gandalf thought the Necromancer might have been one of the Nazgûl, at worst.
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Voronwë the Faithful
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Also, making Dol Guldur into a big battle risks distracting too much attention from the real story line of The Hobbit. After all, in the book, the only real purpose of the Dol Guldur sideline is to remove Gandalf from the scene so that Bilbo can establish his importance. It would counterproductive to turn around and use that sideline to reduce Bilbo's importance!
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
Oh I agree...it should definitely be a covert operation in any case, but a few elite corps Elves as backup as well as the key wizards and High Elves would be practical!
There is magic in long-distance friendships. They let you relate to other human beings in a way that goes beyond being physically together and is often more profound.
~Diana Cortes
~Diana Cortes
How does a fortress fall in a covert operation? Unless someone sneaks inside and opens a gate in the middle of the night, a siege is a noisy, smelly, messy operation that requires a sizeable force. Of course, this might be a place for Elrond's sons and Legolas to show off their skill and/or dumb luck by sliding through a drain and letting in a squad to clear the walls . . .
No more thinking for the next two weeks, Ethelwynn!
Is everyone still good with us getting started on the actual writing after this weekend? I know that was the original timeline. Is anyone game to set the tone by writing the first scene for us?
No more thinking for the next two weeks, Ethelwynn!
Is everyone still good with us getting started on the actual writing after this weekend? I know that was the original timeline. Is anyone game to set the tone by writing the first scene for us?
Bite off more than you can chew. Then, chew it. Ask for seconds.
Gosh, it got quiet around here. . .-
Primula Baggins
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There was this wedding. . . .
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Voronwë the Faithful
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Primula Baggins
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<simper>
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Voronwë the Faithful
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Primula Baggins
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All shall be revealed in time.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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QuackingTroll
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Indeed, now the royal wedding is out of the way... We're startng with Gandalf narrating "In a hole in the ground". Is it necessary to then discribe the hole or do we go straight on to Bilbo? If it's a stand-alone film "Concerning hobbits" could be a fun opening...
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QuackingTroll
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Who else would narrate? Bilbo likes to tell storys, but him describing himself won't work. Thorin can't narrate if he's going to die, and their quest is of fairly little importance to anybody else. If Bard or Elrond were to recount the tale, for instance, the story wouldn't revolve around Bilbo at all...
Maybe Balin? Since he and Gandalf visit Bilbo at the end. If Balin is made a more prominent character his tomb in LotR would have more impact.But I like the idea of Gandalf narrating up until Beorn and then pulling out to him explaining the tale to Beorn.
Here's an interesting intro which in my opinion won't work, but I'll just throw it out there incase you guys can make it better (it has some vague potential)... How about introduction in Beorn's garden. A wizard comes wandering toward Beorn and introduces Thorin Oakenshield. He then begins telling the tale from before Bilbo's house, the scene goes into a flashback. Gandalf can continue narrating and we could slip in the line "in a hole in the ground" fairly easily.
In my opinion this toys with the story too much, but I thought someone might like it
Maybe Balin? Since he and Gandalf visit Bilbo at the end. If Balin is made a more prominent character his tomb in LotR would have more impact.But I like the idea of Gandalf narrating up until Beorn and then pulling out to him explaining the tale to Beorn.
Here's an interesting intro which in my opinion won't work, but I'll just throw it out there incase you guys can make it better (it has some vague potential)... How about introduction in Beorn's garden. A wizard comes wandering toward Beorn and introduces Thorin Oakenshield. He then begins telling the tale from before Bilbo's house, the scene goes into a flashback. Gandalf can continue narrating and we could slip in the line "in a hole in the ground" fairly easily.
In my opinion this toys with the story too much, but I thought someone might like it
May the hair on your toes never fall out
The most likely options are actually Bilbo, Frodo or Sam, reading from the Red Book. Or of course, we could go like Tolkien did and simply use an unnamed narrator.
Gandalf would be close to my last choice. In fact, in general I dislike using narrators who are within the frame of the story. Ideally I would go with Frodo, Sam or an unnamed Narrator.
Gandalf would be close to my last choice. In fact, in general I dislike using narrators who are within the frame of the story. Ideally I would go with Frodo, Sam or an unnamed Narrator.
The Vinyamars on Stage! This time at Bag End
I'll put in a vote for Gandalf doing the initial narration. He's the one that goes to find Bilbo, and since I think he knew from the start that Bilbo was his "target Hobbit" I think he should introduce him. IMO the narrator should not be someone in the future if the story is a standalone. Elrond or Galadriel could also do the narration, since they were around for the story, but Gandalf is my favorite.
Of course, whoever writes the scene will have the ultimate say in who the narrator is. Any volunteers?
Of course, whoever writes the scene will have the ultimate say in who the narrator is. Any volunteers?
Bite off more than you can chew. Then, chew it. Ask for seconds.
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Voronwë the Faithful
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I also would vote against Gandalf as the narrator. But then, I don't want any of the characters as the narrator, as I think that like in the book, the narrator should be separate from the story.
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
The thing we haven't considered yet is whether we are going to have a narrator all the way through the films? I'd rather thought we wouldn't be adopting that convention in translating the book to screen... I do agree that the iconic lines should be the opening, so we obviously need a narrator for this and I think rather than some nameless voiceover it should be a voice we recognize and is relevant to the story. For me, Gandalf fits the bill for the opening but I wouldn't want him narrating the whole tale!
Edited to fix typo and also add that it would be great, Al, if you are willing and able to start us off with the opening scene!
Edited to fix typo and also add that it would be great, Al, if you are willing and able to start us off with the opening scene!
Last edited by Elentári on Tue May 03, 2011 5:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.
There is magic in long-distance friendships. They let you relate to other human beings in a way that goes beyond being physically together and is often more profound.
~Diana Cortes
~Diana Cortes