North Korea fires long range missile

[superwizard]

North Korea fired a long ranged missile today

TOKYO (AP) -- Defying stern warnings from Washington and Tokyo, North Korea launched a long-range missile Wednesday that may be capable of reaching America, two U.S. officials said. But they said the missile failed after 35 or 40 seconds.

The audacious military exercise by the isolated communist nation came as the United States celebrated the Fourth of July holiday and launched the space shuttle Discovery from Cape Canaveral, Fla.

"We are urgently consulting with members of the Security Council," said John Bolton, the U.S. ambassador to the United Nations.

The North also fired two other missiles, the State Department said. Initial intelligence indicates that one was a Scud missile and the other a Rodong. The Scuds are short-range and could target South Korea. The Rodong has a range of about 620 miles and could target Japan.




All three landed in the Sea of Japan between Japan and the Korean Peninsula, said the Japanese government.

State Department officials, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said the long-range missile was the Taepodong-2, North Korea's most advanced missile with a range of up to 9,320 miles. Experts believe a Taepodong-2 could reach the United States with a light payload.

The launch came after weeks of speculation that the North was preparing to test the Taepodong-2 from a site on its northeast coast. The preparations had generated stern warnings from the United States and Japan, which had threatened possible economic sanctions in response.

"North Korea has gone ahead with the launch despite international protest," Japanese Chief Cabinet Secretary Shinzo Abe said. "That is regrettable from the standpoint of Japan's security, the stability of international society, and non-proliferation of weapons of mass destruction."

The missiles all landed hundreds of miles away from Japan and there were no reports the missiles caused damage within Japanese territory, Abe said.

He said the first missile was launched at about 3:30 a.m. Wednesday, or about 2:30 p.m. Tuesday EDT. The two others were launched at bout 4 a.m. and 5 a.m., he said.

If the timing is correct, the North Korean missiles were launched within minutes of Tuesday's liftoff of Discovery, which blasted into orbit from Cape Canaveral in the first U.S. space shuttle launch in a year.

It was not clear which launch was the long-range missile. The Japanese government was unable to confirm the report by U.S. officials that a Taepodong-2 was fired.

Han Song Ryol, deputy chief of North Korea's mission to the U.N. in New York, told The Associated Press in a telephone interview: "We diplomats do not know what the military is doing."

North Korea's missile program is based on Scud technology provided by the former Soviet Union or Egypt, according to American and South Korean officials. North Korea started its Rodong-1 missile project in the late 1980s and test-fired the missile for the first time in 1993.

North Korea had observed a moratorium on long-range missile launches since 1999. It shocked the world in 1998 by firing a Taepodong missile over Japan and into the Pacific Ocean.

On Monday, the North's main news agency quoted an unidentified newspaper analyst as saying Pyongyang was prepared to answer a U.S. military attack with "a relentless annihilating strike and a nuclear war."

The Bush administration responded by saying while it had no intention of attacking, it was determined to protect the United States if North Korea launched a long-range missile.

On Monday, Undersecretary of State Nicholas Burns warned North Korea against firing the missile and urged the communist country to return to six-nation talks on its nuclear program.

The six-party talks, suspended by North Korea, involved negotiations by the United States, China, South Korea, Japan and Russia with Pyongyang over the country's nuclear program.

The United States and its allies South Korea and Japan have taken quick steps over the past week to strengthen their missile defenses. Washington and Tokyo are working on a joint missile-defense shield, and South Korea is considering the purchase of American SM-2 defensive missiles for its destroyers.

The U.S. and North Korea have been in a standoff over Pyongyang's nuclear weapons program since 2002. The North claims to have produced nuclear weapons, but that claim has not been publicly verified by outside analysts.

While public information on North Korea's military capabilities is murky, experts doubt that the regime has managed to develop a nuclear warhead small enough to mount on its long-range missiles.

Nonetheless, Lt. Gen. Michael Maples, director of the Defense Intelligence Agency, told U.S. lawmakers last week that officials took the potential launch reports seriously and were looking at the full range of capabilities possessed by North Korea.

© 2006 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

So what do you think about this, superwizard?

[superwizard]

Well I feel that N Korea is trying to grab attention of the american and indeed the world. They seem to be put off by the fact that they aren't from page news. They launched the missile within minutes of NASA's launch. Coincidence I think not. Do they want to start a war I doubt it but they seem to want attention.

Why don't you post V now

[Primula Baggins]

See, it was your turn first, superwizard.

My opinion? Er . . . gotta run.

[superwizard]

I just want to add that as a future resident of California I feel particularly threatened.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

You want to know what I think? Okay, you asked.

I think it is scary for any country to have intercontinental nuclear missiles. And the more the country has, the scarier I think that country is. Can you figure out which country I think is the scariest country in the world?

Well, you did ask.

[superwizard]

Well V I wish to quote something you might find familiar.

The Hall of Fire is an Internet community formed to discuss the works of J.R.R. Tolkien and other topics of interest in the arts, literature, politics, and philosophy. Our goal is to maintain an atmosphere of quiet and courtesy so that serious discussion can flourish among people with diverse ideas and perspectives

Of course I want to know what you think that's why I joined this place!!:D

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Hmmmm, that does sound familiar. Now where have I seen that before?



So, what do you think should be done now that North Korea has fired off this missile? Should we bomb their nuclear facilities and risk their threatened nuclear counter-attack?

[Whistler]

Honest opinion?

The number of missles is absolutely irrelevant, and the drawing of any moral parallel between America and North Korea offends me beyond my considerable powers of expression.

What is relevant is whether the person with his finger on the button happens to be a psychotic. Whatever one's opinion of President Bush, or of any president, I think it is beyond the pale to suggest that his access to our vast arsenal makes America a greater threat than a barbaric dictatorship ruled by a Warner Brothers cartoon character who literally teaches his people that he was born in a log cabin, above which shone (as in Bethlehem) a supernaturally-appearing star.

[superwizard]

So, what do you think should be done now that North Korea has fired off this missile? Should we bomb their nuclear facilities and risk their threatened nuclear counter-attack?

My opinion NO. I don't think its worth the consequeces that N Korea might do. Remember if they do counter-attack California would be in pretty great risk (I'm guessing you'd care about that V)

[Voronwë the Faithful]

That is certainly an honest (and fair) opinion. Kim Jong is definitely a terrifyingly unstable leader (just as was Saddam Hussein) and his having his hand on a nuclear button is very scary. But I stand by my belief that the United States is very largely responsible for the predicament that the world finds itself in now. Could different choices have been made at some point over the past 60 plus years? It's hard to say. Perhaps the world would be in a much worse place had the U.S. not constantly upped the nuclear ante. But we continue to reap the seeds that we have sown.

Edited to add: Cross-posted with Superwizard. I was, of course, responding to Whistler.

[Frelga]

a barbaric dictatorship ruled by a Warner Brothers cartoon character who literally teaches his people that he was born in a log cabin, above which shone (as in Bethlehem) a supernaturally-appearing star.

Log cabin? Abe Lincoln is the president of North Korea?

My serious opinion for the near to mid-term future makes no sense in light of the fact that I still haven't moved to a bunker.

Attention? If attention is all they want, we are in better shape than I believe. Whatever else is true about the war in Iraq, that war made it painfully obvlious to the world that the U.S. is currently in no state to wage a military campaign anywhere else in the world. We could, of course, launch our own missile or even a nuclear strike. I hope nobody with the power to order one is insane enough to try. I really don't want a counterstrike hitting California.

[Whistler]

Yes, he does present himself as Abraham Lincoln, Jesus, or whoever is most likely to impress and intimidate. Of course, he isn't quite tall enough for Lincoln, so he wears ridiculous platform shoes that his people are not supposed to notice.

His people are also forbidden to fold a sheet of paper on which his sacred image is printed.

[axordil]

It would actually be more difficult than many think for any POTUS to unilaterally launch even one nuke pre-emptively. There are safeguards and firebreaks built into the system galore...on the other hand, I am EXTREMELY concerned about the development of new US nuclear devices that appear to be designed for use in non-MAD situations, that is, whenever we think it needful, as opposed to in the direst of crises.

Anyway, the REAL problem in NK is not their Fearless Leader (and I always think of him more as a Rocky and Bullwinkle character than Warner Bros. ) but the military shadows behind him who actually rule the place, and about whom we know damn close to diddley. Like what they are really after. And what they are willing to do to avoid losing power.

[truehobbit]

On the most general level, I'm with Voronwë on this.

However, looking at the particular case, I wouldn't compare the US and North Korea.

More specifically about North Korea, then, I think the problem is less that it might actually want to attack the US (or some other country) - I find it hard to imagine they would be quite that stupid, no matter how demented the leadership is in other respects.

The problem is that the country is suffering under a crazed despot (can't tell about the real powers in the regime that Ax mentioned, I'm afraid), and prefers to let the population starve so it can find means to expand its arsenal. A pathetic power trying to compensate for its lack of importance is bad enough in the best cases, but if that power is an ego-maniacal dictatorship it's intolerable, even more for the harm it does to the country itself than for the threat it may pose to the international community.
The sad thing is that it seems impossible to do anything about it in a civilised way.

[Lidless]

Having said all of that, the US has repeatedly stated its right (of course) to defend itself in any manner it deems fit.

So what is wrong with another nation testing part of its delivery system? Is merely testing a threatening act? Sure, the timing was a deliberate political message and NK's leader no brighter than a broken light bulb, but so what?

[halplm]

Ah let em blow us up... we're the cause of all the worlds problems after all... right?

[vison]

This is one of those occasions when I wonder why certain powers (not only the US, but a few others here and there, including Canada) don't work toward some kind of generalized assassination plot that would get Kim and his string-pullers. A real attempt would destabilize the place if nothing else and might make them pull in their horns while they dealt with it.

On the other hand, it might not.

As was the case with Iraq, IMHO, the people of North Korea must deal with it themselves. Only, will they ever? I know how futile it sounds, but it could happen. I mean, they are not entirely unaware of the outer world, more and more they learn about what's going on elsewhere. How long will it be before they rise up in some way?

The other thing is, Korea, or the two Koreas, have always been on bad terms with each other. The North has always hated the South and vice versa, and this goes back for centuries. And men named Park (Pak), Lee, and Kim have always ruled Korea.

[Lidless]

Ah let em blow us up... we're the cause of all the worlds problems after all... right?

Don't be silly. I can't blame the US for Keith Chegwin.

[Túrin Turambar]

Maybe I’m just a bit of an isolationist over foreign policy, but I’m not too concerned over this. I still doubt that North Korea actually does have nuclear weapons, I have serious doubts about the long- or even medium-term viability of the country, and the missile failed forty seconds into flight. Ronald Reagan told us not to be afraid of the Communists, and I think that if his advice was relevant when hardline Communists ruled half the world then it is relevant when there’s only one serious Communist country left.

That isn’t too say that North Korea’s belligerency isn’t a worry. The regime is arguably insane and desperate nations can do stupid things. Still, their options are seriously limited. I can’t see China following them into a war with the west, South Korea is much stronger now than it was fifty years ago and the United States and its allies easily have the firepower to lay the country to waste should it try anything. It would have been great if North Korea had have been defeated in 1953, but for now I think we need to be satisfied with containment, intimidation and the hope that the country will pull a Germany of its own accord.