Trump's America

The place for measured discourse about politics and current events, including developments in science and medicine.
Post Reply
User avatar
Voronwë the Faithful
At the intersection of here and now
Posts: 46144
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Trump's America

Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

As a coincidence, I am currently rereading Wouk's 2000+ page WW II opus The Winds of War / War and Remembrance.

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
User avatar
Frelga
Meanwhile...
Posts: 22487
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:31 pm
Location: Home, where else

Re: Trump's America

Post by Frelga »

Voronwë the Faithful wrote:Meanwhile, apparently Trump’s New choice for national security adviser to replace Flynn, retired Vice Admiral Robert Harward, has turned down the offer.
He is said to have described the offer in graphic and unflattering terms that will not pass the word filter here.

I started to type about my long disused, Soviet-time habit of reading between the lines, typed "between the lies" instead, and I think that's 'nuff said.

At least Acosta for Labor Secretary seems a legitimate pick, according to NYT.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/16/us/p ... trump.html
If there was anything that depressed him more than his own cynicism, it was that quite often it still wasn't as cynical as real life.

Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
User avatar
Sunsilver
Posts: 8857
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 2:41 am
Location: In my rose garden
Contact:

Re: Trump's America

Post by Sunsilver »

'between the lies'...oh, good one, Frelga! Wish it wasn't true... :(
When the night has been too lonely, and the road has been too long,
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
User avatar
Jude
Lán de Grás
Posts: 8251
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2006 4:54 pm

Re: Trump's America

Post by Jude »

It's a Trumpian slip.
Image
User avatar
Voronwë the Faithful
At the intersection of here and now
Posts: 46144
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Trump's America

Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

At least Acosta for Labor Secretary seems a legitimate pick, according to NYT.
Yes, Acosta is at least qualified. He would certainly not be my pick, but he is worlds better than Puzder. And the first and only Hispanic member of Trump's cabinet.
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
User avatar
Sunsilver
Posts: 8857
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 2:41 am
Location: In my rose garden
Contact:

Re: Trump's America

Post by Sunsilver »

Canada's national newsmagazine sums it all up:

https://scontent.fyto1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/ ... e=593464AE

It boggles my mind that there are people I've known for a long time, and consider friends, who support this man...because, you know, he's a CHRISTIAN, supports the Christian Right agenda, is going to end abortion and put prayer back in the schools... and, of course, that's going to fix EVERYTHING! :cry:

How could you be so naive as to think this crotch-grabbing sexual predator with a string of bankruptcies behind him could possibly govern the U.S.A.?

Yeah, I know - him or Clinton... [sigh!]
When the night has been too lonely, and the road has been too long,
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
User avatar
Sunsilver
Posts: 8857
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2006 2:41 am
Location: In my rose garden
Contact:

Re: Trump's America

Post by Sunsilver »

Okay, after posting that depressing piece, I had to post THIS for a bit of light, comic relief.

Posted on F.B. by Susan Keller, Layton N.J.

I can't believe I'm saying this, but it looks like Trump is actually making America great again. Just look at the progress made since the election:
1. Unprecedented levels of ongoing civic engagement.
2. Millions of Americans now know who their state and federal representatives are without having to google.
3. Millions of Americans are exercising more. They're holding signs and marching every week.
4. Alec Baldwin is great again. Everyone's forgotten he's kind of a jerk.
5. The Postal Service is enjoying the influx cash due to stamps purchased by millions of people for letter and postcard campaigns.
6. Likewise, the pharmaceutical industry is enjoying record growth in sales of anti-depressants.
7. Millions of Americans now know how to call their elected officials and know exactly what to say to be effective.
8. Footage of town hall meetings is now entertaining.
9. Tens of millions of people are now correctly spelling words like emoluments, narcissist, fascist, misogynist, holocaust and cognitive dissonance.
10. Everyone knows more about the rise of Hitler than they did last year.
11. Everyone knows more about legislation, branches of power and how checks and balances work.
12. Marginalized groups are experiencing a surge in white allies.
13. White people in record numbers have just learned that racism is not dead. (See #6)
14. White people in record numbers also finally understand that Obamacare IS the Affordable Care Act.
15. Stephen Colbert's "Late Night" finally gained the elusive #1 spot in late night talk shows, and Seth Meyers is finding his footing as today's Jon Stewart.
16. "Mike Pence" has donated millions of dollars to Planned Parenthood since Nov. 9th.
17. Trump has succeeded where thousands of history teachers failed - now everybody knows who Frederick Douglass was.
18. Melissa FREAKING McCarthy.
19. Travel ban protesters put $24 million into ACLU coffers in just 48 hours, enabling them to hire 200 more attorneys. Lawyers are now heroes.
20. As people seek veracity in their news sources, respected news outlets are happily reporting a substantial increase in subscriptions, a boon to a struggling industry vital to our democracy.
21. Live streaming court cases and congressional sessions are now as popular as the Kardashians.
22. Massive cleanup of facebook friend lists.
23. People are reading classic literature again. Sales of George Orwell's "1984" increased by 10,000% after the inauguration. (Yes, that is true. 10,000%. 9th grade Lit teachers all over the country are now rock stars.)
24. More than ever before, Americans are aware that education is important. Like, super important.
25. Now, more than anytime in history, everyone believes that anyone can be President. Seriously, anyone.
When the night has been too lonely, and the road has been too long,
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
User avatar
River
bioalchemist
Posts: 13431
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 1:08 am
Location: the dry land

Re: Trump's America

Post by River »

I'd like to take a moment to quietly contemplate all the things that happened last night in Sweden.
When you can do nothing what can you do?
User avatar
Frelga
Meanwhile...
Posts: 22487
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:31 pm
Location: Home, where else

Re: Trump's America

Post by Frelga »

I heard the survivors of the Bowling Green Massacre are reaching out to those affected by the events Last Night in Sweden.
If there was anything that depressed him more than his own cynicism, it was that quite often it still wasn't as cynical as real life.

Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
User avatar
Primula Baggins
Living in hope
Posts: 40005
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:43 am
Location: Sailing the luminiferous aether
Contact:

Re: Trump's America

Post by Primula Baggins »

Solidarity! Brings a tear to my eye.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
User avatar
yovargas
I miss Prim ...
Posts: 15011
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2005 12:13 am
Location: Florida

Re: Trump's America

Post by yovargas »

Poor, poor Sweden.
:cry: :cry: :cry:
I wanna love somebody but I don't know how
I wanna throw my body in the river and drown
-The Decemberists


Image
User avatar
Frelga
Meanwhile...
Posts: 22487
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:31 pm
Location: Home, where else

Re: Trump's America

Post by Frelga »

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/02/t ... ape-235204

Milo Yiannopoulos got uninvited as a keynote speaker at the Conservative Political Action Conference, based on the tapes in which he defends relationships between teenage boys and older men. At the same time, his upcoming book was canceled by the publisher.
Some prominent conservatives seemed to suggest that CPAC had provoked the maelstrom by tying itself to such a controversial figure.

“The Milo Test,” wrote Charlie Sykes, a conservative former radio host who has written critically of the Republican Party since the rise of Trump. “Anti-Semitism, ok. Racism, ok. Alt Right, ok. Advocacy of pedophilia? Is THAT the bridge too far?”
If there was anything that depressed him more than his own cynicism, it was that quite often it still wasn't as cynical as real life.

Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
User avatar
Primula Baggins
Living in hope
Posts: 40005
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:43 am
Location: Sailing the luminiferous aether
Contact:

Re: Trump's America

Post by Primula Baggins »

Is Schadenfreude a sin?
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
User avatar
yovargas
I miss Prim ...
Posts: 15011
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2005 12:13 am
Location: Florida

Re: Trump's America

Post by yovargas »

A friend recently sent me a link to a post where Milo explicitly said that the genocide and enslavement of natives committed by Europeans was okay because Europeans were the superior race. And that the victims of those atrocities should stop "whining" about it.

But I guess sex with teen boys is pretty bad too.
I wanna love somebody but I don't know how
I wanna throw my body in the river and drown
-The Decemberists


Image
User avatar
Jude
Lán de Grás
Posts: 8251
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2006 4:54 pm

Re: Trump's America

Post by Jude »

He's a classic troll - he probably doesn't believe all that stuff, but thrives on the outrage and negative attention.

Better to ignore him, not give him a platform, and not react to anything he says.
Image
User avatar
Primula Baggins
Living in hope
Posts: 40005
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:43 am
Location: Sailing the luminiferous aether
Contact:

Re: Trump's America

Post by Primula Baggins »

I agree that the wisest reaction to a troll is no reaction. But in general trolls are a localized problem. They generally don't have platforms.

The problem in this case is that Yiannopoulos still has full use of some very good platforms (and I'm quite willing to bet that he'll be at CPAC next year after this has all officially fallen down the memory hole). Not reacting to him means yielding the ground—normalizing people like him as people who have every right to the same microphone as decent human beings; people who should be invited onto television shows for an exchange of views with decent human beings, while decent human beings watch.

It's saying, hey, there are two sides to every argument; let's hear him out just to be fair; his beliefs should get the same weight as those of decent human beings. Otherwise we're just as bad as he is!

And so he gets to spew his views, because we all want to be fair and collegial. Racism, sexism, all of that was not over the line; it took condoning adult sex with children to dislodge him.

The bar has already been lowered too damn far.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
User avatar
Voronwë the Faithful
At the intersection of here and now
Posts: 46144
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:41 am
Contact:

Re: Trump's America

Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

I've seen no evidence that Yiannopoulos does not absolutely believe the vile things that he says and writes.

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
User avatar
River
bioalchemist
Posts: 13431
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 1:08 am
Location: the dry land

Re: Trump's America

Post by River »

If advocating pedophilia is the only thing that keeps Milo out of a room maybe the right really is more tolerant than the left...

The weird thing about that when I run across his stuff it reads like satire. And yet I've been told over and over it's not. Does that mean he truly believes that cellulite is the worst thing ever? Seriously? People are supposed to be taking that seriously??

I did see a delightful HuffPost teaser/headline thing about Milo's transphobic views in conjuction with a photo of him draped in pearls and looking even more androgynous than usual.
When you can do nothing what can you do?
User avatar
Frelga
Meanwhile...
Posts: 22487
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:31 pm
Location: Home, where else

Re: Trump's America

Post by Frelga »

It's not about Yiannopoulos, though. It's the hypocrisy of the CPAC.
“Due to the revelation of an offensive video in the past 24 hours condoning pedophilia, the American Conservative Union has decided to rescind the invitation,” said Matt Schlapp, chairman of the group which sponsors CPAC, in a statement Monday afternoon. The group called Yiannopoulos to “further address these disturbing comments,” but defended its original decision to invite him as a nod to “the free speech issue on college campuses.”
Highlight mine.

So if Yiannopoulos saying offensive things is enough to cancel his speaking engagement and his book, does that mean that they did not find any of his previous statements offensive?
If there was anything that depressed him more than his own cynicism, it was that quite often it still wasn't as cynical as real life.

Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
User avatar
Primula Baggins
Living in hope
Posts: 40005
Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:43 am
Location: Sailing the luminiferous aether
Contact:

Re: Trump's America

Post by Primula Baggins »

Bingo!
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
Post Reply