So there's this riot going on right now

[axordil]

I'm suggesting they had the facts earlier--which they clearly did--and didn't release them until they were also forced to release Wilson's name. Were I inclined to be charitable I might ignore the inference. But things like http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2 ... y-lie.html linger, ya know? It will be a cold day in Hell before I trust a Ferguson cop.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I would like to believe that the PD was motivated at least in part by some kind of sensitivity for the victim in not initially revealing that he was a suspect in a robbery, but I haven't seen very much that would support such an inference, and the way the information was released today strongly contradicts it.

[Frelga]

We haven't seen much sensitivity, or sense, in their handling of anything so far. It doesn't seem very sensitive to me that they would let the community believe that they were mourning a young man killed for jaywalking for almost a week. And why didn't they talk to the press instead of arresting and tear-gassing them (in separate incidents)? This is a massive screw-up any way you look at it.

One of the articles mentioned that Brown was admitted to college.

[Cerin]

It doesn't seem very sensitive to me that they would let the community believe that they were mourning a young man killed for jaywalking for almost a week.

Anyone who believed a young man was killed for jaywalking wasn't paying attention. My point was, withholding the information on the robbery allowed the public to focus on the tragedy of Brown's death, rather than on extraneous details. I don't say this is why the information was withheld, but it occurred to me as one possible reason. It would be a matter of respect, as whatever other issues there are to be resolved here, they all pale in comparison to the loss of life.

[JewelSong]

Apparently the officer involved in the shooting was not aware of the robbery.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Meanwhile, despite the kinder and gentler police approach, more violence and looting apparently broke out last night.

[axordil]

Unfortunate but true. Though two hopeful things happened as well: protesters attempted to stop the looting, often succesfully, and the police responded proportionately, staying retail instead of going wholesale, as it were, treating criminals as criminals and not as an opposing army. As one interview on NPR said this morning (quote not exact): the police exist to serve the community, not harass it.

If they forget that they need to find another line of work.

[Cerin]

Apparently the officer involved in the shooting was not aware of the robbery.

Jewel, my understanding is he was aware of the robbery, and that's the reason he was dispatched to the area, but he hadn't been given a description of the suspects before he got involved with Brown. Perhaps someone with a grasp of the details can clarify.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Cerin, that is my understanding as well. So it is possible that the officer was motivated in part in some way by the knowledge that there had been an alleged robbery, even though he did not know that this young man was a suspect. We just don't know, because the police still haven't provided any information at all on the shooting, despite releasing the information about the alleged robbery. Which I think is completely outrageous.

[axordil]

The Ferguson PD's communication skills would be improved by time with Annie Sullivan.

I've pieced together what seems to have happened from the accounts: at some point during the confrontation over the teens walking on the street and not the sidewalk, Wilson noted they had cigarellos, put two and two together, and escalated the encounter from mere harassment to an arrest attempt. Prudent? Probably not. Understandable? Yes. Brown attempted to get away. Things got physical, and Wilson went for his gun.

At that moment, I actually still have some sympathy for Wilson. Brown was bigger and probably stronger, and despite training, panic can still take hold of you. A Taser would have been preferable, obviously, but maybe during the wrestling it was in a less accessible position.

So two things happened next, in an order I'm not sure anyone except the medical examiner knows--Brown runs and Brown gets shot. If the autopsy shows a bullet wound with powder on his front side, that means the first shot happened up close. If the autopsy shows a bullet wound in the back, with or without powder, it means Brown broke free first and Wilson shot him fleeing.

Even at that point there's a legal argument Wilson had the law on his side--if he thought Brown was dangerous and violent, shooting him as he fled is not always illegal.

But when Brown turned, put his hands up, and (according to some witnesses) went to his knees, the law is clear and unequivocal. Any more shots are an illegal execution. Again, if the autopsy shows bullet wounds in his front without powder, Wilson is guilty of voluntary manslaughter.

[Cerin]

We just don't know, because the police still haven't provided any information at all on the shooting, despite releasing the information about the alleged robbery. Which I think is completely outrageous.

What else could practically be done? On the one hand, you have a robbery solely under the jurisdiction of the Ferguson police dept., in which there was video evidence and a confession. Already people are criticizing the Ferguson police for having withheld that information for as long as they did. On the other hand, there is an ongoing investigation into the shooting, with conflicting testimony from the participants and witnesses, which is also being investigated by the FBI. Are the police even allowed to publicly comment on that while it is ongoing?

So which are you suggesting in lieu of the 'outrageous' behavior:

1) Ferguson police should have continued to withhold information about the robbery until the investigation of the shooting was complete (who knows when that will be).

2) Ferguson police should be leaking incomplete information about their ongoing investigation of the shooting, which is also under scrutiny by the FBI?

[Cerin]

<snip>and the police responded proportionately, staying retail instead of going wholesale, as it were, treating criminals as criminals and not as an opposing army.

I agree that getting rid of the militarized gear is a big improvement, but I wonder how the owners of businesses that were damaged feel about the more laissez-faire attitude?

A small crowd later looted the convenience store, where Brown is alleged to have shoplifted cigars minutes before he was shot dead. A meat market was also looted and other businesses had windows smashed. Police did not intervene.

http://readersupportednews.org/news-sec ... -overnight

[Voronwë the Faithful]

But when Brown turned, put his hands up, and (according to some witnesses) went to his knees, the law is clear and unequivocal. Any more shots are an illegal execution. Again, if the autopsy shows bullet wounds in his front without powder, Wilson is guilty of voluntary manslaughter.

No. That scenario, if proven true, is Murder 2. At least. Maybe even Murder 1.

We just don't know, because the police still haven't provided any information at all on the shooting, despite releasing the information about the alleged robbery. Which I think is completely outrageous.

What else could practically be done? On the one hand, you have a robbery solely under the jurisdiction of the Ferguson police dept., in which there was video evidence and a confession. Already people are criticizing the Ferguson police for having withheld that information for as long as they did. On the other hand, there is an ongoing investigation into the shooting, with conflicting testimony from the participants and witnesses, which is also being investigated by the FBI. Are the police even allowed to publicly comment on that while it is ongoing?

So which are you suggesting in lieu of the 'outrageous' behavior:

1) Ferguson police should have continued to withhold information about the robbery until the investigation of the shooting was complete (who knows when that will be).

2) Ferguson police should be leaking incomplete information about their ongoing investigation of the shooting, which is also under scrutiny by the FBI?

There was no confession. In fact, the police chief, Thomas Jackson, has confirmed that Dorian Johnson "was not involved in the robbery" and that they "will not seek charges against him."

The way the information was selectively released was so clearly done to try to justify the shooting, that is what I found outrageous. Certainly I do not want them to compromise the ongoing investigation, but there is ways of providing information that would not do that, as we have seen many times in the past.

[Cerin]

There was no confession. In fact, the police chief, Thomas Jackson, has confirmed that Dorian Johnson "was not involved in the robbery" and that they "will not seek charges against him."

You are right, 'confession' was the wrong word to use. Johnson confirmed he was with Brown when Brown robbed the store. The point I was getting at was, the facts of the robbery had been established, whereas the investigation into the shooting is ongoing.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

It was the way it was orchestrated that I found disconcerting, withholding the name of the shooter for days, then finally revealing it, with no other information about the shooting, and adding "oh by the way the dead victim was the suspect in a "strong-armed robbery" (which in reality turns out to be little more than shoplifting). To me it clearly seemed orchestrated to try to somehow justify or excuse the shooting.

[axordil]

Or tit for tat pettiness...make us release the police officer's name, we'll toss this in for free. Or worse: an attempt to incite exactly the kind of increased violence they got last night to show that the military response was the "correct" one. But the peaceful protesters are now talking--even co-operating--with the highway patrol captain who's the new boss on the ground, as Antonio French's tweets from last night show.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

What's worse is that apparently the DoJ advised against releasing the alleged robbery video because they feared that would incite new violence, but the PD released it anyway, predictably inciting new violence.

[Passdagas the Brown]

Despite what many believe, the feds usually think these sorts of things through much more intelligently than the locals.

[Frelga]

I was on the road today and not able to follow the news beyond a few Twitter feeds. I do think that the article ax linked on last page is very important in understanding what happened. If a man who got arrested by mistake ends up beaten bloody and charged with bleeding on cops, no wonder another man does not peacefully surrender when being arrested for a petty crime. Ultimately, reputation for police brutality puts police officers in danger.

This was never just about Brown himself.

[axordil]

Ultimately, reputation for police brutality puts police officers in danger.

Which tends to make the police more brutal...and you spiral into the abyss.