The 2012 US Election

Thu Nov 15, 2012 8:19 pm

I saw that segment this morning. Brilliant!

Post by **nerdanel** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 2:03 am

Thanks River, Teremia, JS. If I read your posts correctly, they were quite flattering. However, I might not be reading them correctly because I am a minority and therefore have poorer reading comprehension than white people, as some Texas conservatives explained this week.

Again, this may be due to the intellectual deficits with which I must contend as a minority, but it is unclear to me why people who are racist, sexist, or homophobic are still saying ... stuff. And things.

Post by **River** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 2:34 am

nerdanel wrote: Again, this may be due to the intellectual deficits with which I must contend as a minority, but it is unclear to me why people who are racist, sexist, or homophobic are still saying ... stuff. And things.

Not clear to me either. Maybe they just don't hear themselves. Or maybe they don't hear themselves as others might hear them...

Post by **Frelga** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 2:36 am

I am pleased to learn that as a white speaker of English as Fourth Language, I naturally have better reading comprehension than a native-born "minority" person.

Who knew language was absorbed through skin!

Unless being female negates these benefits?

Post by **Primula Baggins** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 8:33 am

Oh, absolutely, Frelga. What are you thinking? It's the exact duplicate set of chromosomes, see. "Regular" people don't have that, or any of the other internal tubular stuff that infiltrates the higher brain functions.

And you have to make allowances for nel. She doesn't even have a GED. A JD, sure, but. . . .

Post by **WampusCat** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 9:38 am

Now, Prim. I'm sure nel would have gotten a GED if only she had better reading comprehension. We must not hold her to standards above her capabilities. That would be... unkind.

Post by **Primula Baggins** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:38 pm

Barack Obama is not impressed.

Post by **River** » Sat Nov 17, 2012 4:54 pm

He doesn't quite do it like McKayla, but no one does.

Post by **Griffon64** » Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:39 am

Happy to see you posting more, Prim!

I would like to see the GOP kick the crazies out of the party, because there are some GOP standpoints I support. Hint, not the ones that involves inner tubes or thinking math isn't a thing, or especially the ones that say color IS a thing. ( not an exhaustive list, but a start. )

But there are a few things I do support.

Now that the Democrats have a supermajority in California, what do everybody think will happen? Will the state get up from it's current mess and become awesome?

Post by **Primula Baggins** » Sun Nov 18, 2012 3:54 am

If it can begin to restore part of the former awesomeness of its public education system, K through university, that would be one good use of a supermajority. IMO.

Another would be devising a more efficient healthcare system that covers more Californians. Again IMO.

I am sure Dems are also capable of using it to pass a load of awful ideas. But the last group with one of those wrecked a lot of what was intrinsically amazing about California, in exchange for no benefit to most of its people.

(Not mended yet—haven't even been to the doctor; not an option with no insurance, especially since they would likely send me to surgery. But my state-run insurance plan for healthcare rejects should be effective December 1. All hail the State.

What would cost us $25,000 this month will cost only $5,000 next month.)

Post by **Frelga** » Sun Nov 18, 2012 6:38 am

Well, Prop 30 was pretty much blackmail, IMO, but now that it passed, I am hopeful.

California is ahead of the curve when it comes to implementing the Obamacare. As one of the reform's proponents pointed out, currently insurance companies compete on who can best avoid insuring people who need care. The hope for the reform is to make sure they compete in terms of providing care. It remains to be seen how that plays out.

Post by **Griffon64** » Tue Nov 20, 2012 12:00 am

Prim - I hope sincerely that you can get what you need to return to health. Wow.

My Californian history is somewhat shaky so I'm not sure what happened last time California had a super majority, but I'll look it up.

I'm not sure how the Californian education system came to fall from its highs. That would take a lot of looking at data, per child spending, admin overhead analyzing, etc. If Prop 30 fixes the education system, I will be relieved AND surprised. It did smack of blackmail, but in final analysis it had to pass. I really hope it fixes everything it promises to. The carrot/stick was education, and I'm unsure how much promises around education will actually be fulfilled. I'm eager to be surprised and have my cynicism prove unfounded, though!

Efficiency. That would be my hope!

Post by **Primula Baggins** » Tue Nov 20, 2012 4:24 pm

Griffy, I was mistaken; the damage was done without a supermajority. There hasn't actually been a supermajority in both houses for one party since, I believe, the 1800s.

Post by **Griffon64** » Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:18 pm

Ah, so my Google skills are not as bad as I feared!

Tue Nov 20, 2012 5:37 pm

In my opinion, much of the "damage" in California has been done by the voters themselves, in the out-of-control initiative process.

Post by **Primula Baggins** » Tue Nov 20, 2012 6:40 pm

That is certainly true. But it was also impossible to undo that damage legislatively once the two-thirds rule for tax increases was in place.

Post by **Griffon64** » Tue Nov 20, 2012 6:44 pm

Does anybody have a good ( by good, in this case I mean factual as opposed to colored by opinion ) site that they know of that gives an overview of California's political history that I could look at as a starting point? I have read some opinion pieces here and there about the initiative process, but I don't have a solid overview to start from & supplement by looking at alternate viewpoints.

Which initiatives may have done "damage", in your opinion, V? I also note that you put damage in quotes, so I assume there's a story behind that, too!

Tue Nov 20, 2012 7:12 pm

Griffy, I put "damage" in quotes really only to emphasize that it is "damage" in my opinion. One man's "damage" is another man's "progress".

As for what initiatives I am talking about, here are a few, just off the top of my head:

Prop 184, passed in 1984, in which voters enacted California's draconian three strikes law, which was finally significantly modified this year.

Prop. 209, the so-called Civil Rights Initiative, which ended affirmative action in California.

Prop. 8. Nuf sed.

And the granddaddy of them all, which has caused the most damage (again, of course, in my opinion), Prop. 13, the "People's Initiative to Limit Property Taxation," passed in 1978, which created an unequal taxation system in which basically equivalent properties could be taxed at wildly variant rates, and which among many other effects was the prime reason why California public schools have gone from the best in the nation to the worst.

Post by **Cenedril_Gildinaur** » Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:45 pm

Griffon64 wrote:Now that the Democrats have a supermajority in California, what do everybody think will happen? Will the state get up from it's current mess and become awesome?

It will do something for certain. There have been ideas that have come out of the legislature that even Gov. Moonbeam has thought were too crazy, and he's a natural source of crazy ideas.

The only thing preventing full damage was the two-thirds rule for tax increases and now the Democrats have a 2/3 super-majority. If it weren't for Prop 13, this state would be in far worse shape than it is now. Even after 13 passed tax increases still passed, so proclamations of how it has hamstrung the state are exaggerations.