Take me out to the ballgame!

[vison]

But, Sassafras, only one league has the DH. And yet baseball enjoyed a resurgence in popularity in both leagues!

I agree with every single word Faramond said. And a few he didn't say!

Yeah, and ya messed wit' my head, too, changin' yer essay! Sorta like.....a DH essay?

[Faramond]

There is plenty of strategy left in AL games, yes. The decision to remove the pitcher becomes purely a pitching decision, and there is strategy in that as well.

Pinch hitters and pinch runners who never get in the field and relief pitcher who will never bat are all used, but the price to be paid here is the loss of a player from the game.

I'm more or less happy to let the AL play its way and the NL play its way.

Dear Sass, do you really think I could influence La Griff to dislike the DH?

Cricket is her favorite sport, and the DH is completely alien to the way cricket is played, so I think no matter what influence I had she would have disliked the DH when she heard what it was.

[Griffon64]

I was about to say what vison said about game attendance

Faramond hits the nail right on the head with saying that I don't like the DH because I come from a cricketing background. I already held forth in this thread about how the bowler has to stand there and face the bowling. No-one bats in his place! Also, there's usually about 5 bowlers on a team, of differing batting competence, usually at least two who are complete dunces. But the entire team of 11 bat. And once you're out, you're out! You only get one out an inning.

Yes, cricket is completely opposite of baseball in terms of gaming dynamics. But it also involves hitting a ball with a bat. That is the bit I like

If Faramond happened to support a AL team, I would have had reams to say about the DH, and I would have preferred the NL way of doing it, but I would have supported his team --- pausing sometimes to chirp about the DH, of course

Yep, the only influence he had was to turn me into a Dodger, for better or worse

I'm OK with letting the AL play their way and the NL play their way. I suppose it adds some character and difference in play. Live and let live. Though if I was the chief of all I survey MLB-wise I would kick out the DH rule

[JewelSong]

Oh dear, the DH rants have started without me!

I think the DH completely ruins the symmetry of the game. The "zen" if you will. The thing (well, one of the things!) that makes baseball so different than other sports is that there is not a separate offense and defense...every player plays both.

Now, much of what I would say has been already said. But one of my brothers had the idea that if the DH was attached to the specific pitcher, it might make the rule more tolerable. In other words, Joe Smith is the Designated Hitter for the pitcher, John Brown. But...if John Brown gets taken out of the game, there goes Joe Smith. It sure would be interesting.

Another reason for the original DH rule, besides to boost sagging attendance, was to give sagging players more years of play. Mantle, for instance, had bad knees and could no longer field. If the DH had been in effect during his time, he may have had a number of years left.

Well, ptui, I say. Nine players. Nine positions. The DH ruins the game, as much as I enjoy American League baseball, the National League is the purer sport.

[Alatar]

All joking aside, Baseball seems like a sport I could get interested in. American Football on the other hand really bores me. They tried to bring it in here for some exhibitions and then started showing highlights of the bigger games once a week. Even with all the stopping and starting taken out it was pretty boring. Then they showed the Superbowl. Dear God what a mind-numbing experience. How did this game ever become popular? I can only assume that college football is more exciting. Then again, our national sport is the fastest field sport in the world, so we probably weren't best suiited to enjoying a 5 hour "game".

Baseball, however, looks good. Kids here play a game called "Rounders" which I imagine is a little like Softball. Of course, they play it with Hurleys, or Tennis Rackets or whatever they have to hand

[TheTennisBallKid]

Tennis Rackets

Name them not.





The Superbowl probably isn't the best thing to judge football on, it tends to be an overblown and overlong spectacle between mismatched teams rather than an actual exciting football game.



Go Cubs.



ttbk

[Griffon64]

I watched some ESPN today, and I got to see some football. Hmmm meh. I try to understand it, and it is all right to watch an actual game I think ... just the highlights are a bit boring, which is not something I thought I'd say of any sport

I also saw some ... rodeo.

Man.

What a weird sport THAT is! And the poor little steers or whatever they're called, getting roped like that! Of course, the cowboy later pays for it when a fully grown bull bucks him around and then spikes him into the ground

Anyway, ahem. We're not talking about American sports in general, but baseball in particular.

Alatar - baseball is something it is possible to get interested in! Take it from me. Many a mornin' awake at four in the morning to follow a Dodger game over the Internet

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Bruce Sutter has been elected to the Hall of Fame. The first pitcher that made no starts in his career to make it. His 300 saves ranked 3rd when he retired, but now is only good for 19th. But of those 300 saves, almost half of them were for two innings or more, which is almost unheard of in today's game. One of the last great ones of the old breed of closer.

One of the others, Goose Gossage, fell about 50 votes short, along with Jim Rice. I feel strongly that Rice should be in the Hall; he was such an intimidating presence. The two of them probably won't get in next year either, because Cal Ripkin, Mark McGwire and Tony Gwynn all appear on the ballot for the first time. It should be interesting to see what kind of backlash McGwire experiences.

[Sassafras]

I was sorry Goose wasn't elected but not suprised.

I wonder about McGwire as well. He probably wont make it. At least not on the first ballot. They're still arguing about Pete Rose, aren't they?

Spring Training is only 6 weeks away!

[Griffon64]

The Dodgers are going into Spring Training with both Furcal and Kent just having had "minor" surgery.

*whimper*

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Kind of like Bonds' "minor surgery" last year.

[JewelSong]

Well, well, well - here's some news. Not entirely unexpected, but should make things interesting!

Epstein to Rejoin Red Sox

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I just saw that. Didn't realize there were rumors of his return. But then, out here we had Ken Macha replacing himself as the manager of the A's a couple of weeks after he quit/was fired.

[Sassafras]

Anyone up for the World Baseball Classic?

I just renewed my subscription to mlb.com and as part of the season package I get to watch spring training games (the Yankees have already lost twice to the Phillies!!! ) but also all of the WBC games.

Personally, I think the WBC is very bad timing on Selig's part. It's no suprise that so many have already reneged and that the team managers are almost unanimous in not wanting to subject their players to injury at the beginning of the season.

So, is everyone (except Griff <sm00ch>) rooting for the U.S.?

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I can't really say that I'm rooting for the U.S., not that I'm rooting against them, either. Its a shame that the Dominican team is missing three of its biggest stars - Pedro Martinez, Vlad Guerrero and Manny Ramirez. That's some serious talent. I think they could have given the U.S. a run for their money. The big wild card is the Cubans. Who knows how they will stack up against Major League talent? I'm glad the administration backed down on that. Rumor has it that GWB himself stepped in and told the suits at the Treasury Department to make it happen. Good for him if it is true.

I completely agree on the timing, Sass. Bud must have had his head, um, elsewhere, when he came up with that.

[Sassafras]

I have to support the U.S. team, you see. Three Yankees are on the roster ... Jeter, Rodriguez and Damon (still seems odd to see Damon in pinstripes) and if Rocket pitches ... well ...

Agree that Cuba is the dark horse. I wonder if any of their players will defect? I read somewhere it's a major concern for Castro ...
Don't count Canada out, either.

The thing about the timing is .... when would be a good time. The season is almost seven months long as it is. Do they take 2 weeks around the All-Star break ... or do they play after the WS when everybody is physically and emotionally exhausted?

[Primula Baggins]

I wonder if any of their players will defect? I read somewhere it's a major concern for Castro ...
Don't count Canada out, either.

Yeah, those Canadians—the minute they get on American soil they're begging for asylum. . . .

<poof>

[Sassafras]

[Faramond]

Venezuela.

Just have a squizz at their pitching.

Game 1 against the Dominican Republic - Johan Santana, Carlos Zambrano, Tony Armas

Game 2 against Italy - Freddy Garcia, Carlos Silva, Carlos Hernandez

Game 3 against Australia - Gustavo Chacin, Kelvim Escobar, Jeremy Gonzalez


It is very likely that the final will be Venezuela vs. USA. I don't Cuba has a chance against either Venezuela or the Dominican Republic. They are very young and defections have really hurt them. The only team the USA needs to worry about before the final is Japan, most likely. The only way Cuba plays the USA team is if both teams make the final.


I will be rooting for South Africa of course.

[Griffon64]

Me too [ in response to Faramond's last sentence