Munich

[Ethel]

I just saw this and found it very interesting and troubling. I have a lot of respect for Steven Spielberg as a film maker. He's about as 'mainstream' as they get, but he is extraordinarly skillful. This was a very interesting subject for him to have tackled.

I am old enough to remember the Munich massacre of Israeli Olympic athletes in 1972. It was a complete horror, and still is. But that's not really what the film is about. It's about the "hit squad" that Mossad fielded after the massacre to assassinate those responsible.

I've read that some Israeli viewers of the film are offended by what they see as 'equivalence' being portrayed between the terrorists and their pursuers. I can understand why, but I don't think that's really what the film is about. The Munich massacre is never portrayed as anything but the horrific slaughter of innocents that it was. The Mossad "hit squad" is shown as trying to be very careful about targeting only the guilty - and this in itself is a huge difference between them and their opponents.

Yet some of the Palestinian characters are portrayed (briefly) in somewhat sympathetic ways. I suppose that may be what offends. Yet part of the point of the film is that those on both sides are passionately motivated, and neither is completely right, and neither is completely wrong - though clearly Spielberg feels that more "right" is on the Israeli side. (And I don't disagree. But despite my great sympathy for the state of Israel, it's simply a fact that some Palestinians were driven off their land without compensation; that the land of Israel was won in part with terrorist tactics. This is historical fact, however justified those actions might have been. The grievances of the Palestinians are real, however despicable their tactics often are.)

I did not feel that the film ever suggested that those Palestinian grievances justified the Munich massacre. Similarly, I did not get the impression that Spielberg was suggesting that the Israeli response was wrong. But... certainly the film is about the high personal and social cost involved with being (or feeling forced to be) as ruthless as one's adversaries.

I would be very interested to hear other reactions. It is very far from a "feel good" movie. At one point one of the characters says, "There is no peace down this road." This is likely true. But what other road is there?

[Jnyusa]

Ethel,

I'm glad you started a thread on this movie. I haven't seen it yet and had pretty much decided that I would not do so. For that reason I'm anxious to hear what others have to say about it.

I find Steven Speilberg to be very much the Jewish apologist. In his movies this is done in very subtle ways that ... shape the boundaries of the debate and supress the issues that most need to be revealed. Since I am at odds with the party line on nearly every issue I have pretty much avoided his movies ever since Schindler's List. I dislike him for other reasons as well, not relevant to this movie.

The group that attacked the Olypic athletes was formed in retaliation for the ejection of Palestinians from Jordan in September 1970 by King Hussein, not their rejection from Israel in 1948. So it was particularly inappropriate for the retaliation to take the form that it did; but that is also the point at which the refugee camps relocated to the south of Lebanon and the conflict entered its current phase which has suited Israeli political purposes very well since then.

I would be interested to hear how viewers perceive his treatment of the Israeli government, what are the points against them and what are the points in their favor. Same for the members of Black September. Every movie makes some 'point' and I will be curious to hear how others perceive the point of this movie.

Jn

[vison]

I'm interested as well. I doubt that I'll see the movie, and am curious to know what people think.

My friend Christine saw it the other day and found it very disturbing. She said she wished she hadn't gone.

[Whistler]

I haven't seen it yet.

But when somebody manages to offend people on both sides of an issue, as well as those in the middle, he's probably doing his job pretty well.

[Ethel]

But when somebody manages to offend people on both sides of an issue, as well as those in the middle, he's probably doing his job pretty well.

That's what I thought, Whistler. I thought it was a movie that would offend just about everyone - but in an interesting and thoughtful way.

Jn is right that it made almost no sense that the people offended by the ejection of Palestinians from Jordan should choose to take out their anger on Israeli athletes. I daresay they simply chose the most available and visible target. A lot of terrorism doesn't make much sense.

(Although... in the film... after the hit squad had begun to kill some of the 'architects'... we also hear about other terrorist acts. The attack in the airport in Rome, for instance. "They're talking to us!" the Mossad agent says.)